[Millie]

Dr Naysay, on 27 April 2011 - 10:35 AM, said:

Finally I have been ragging on Wenger for a while and I 100% believe he is to blame for the current malaise, he is too loyal to his players and whilst it is noble of him to defend his players as a lot of other managers do, it has taken him a long time to admit they just have not been good enough. I really believe that he has too often given his teams a pass in the press by blaming every one but his players for big losses. If Man Utd stink up a game Alex Ferguson has no qualms sticking it to his whole team in his interviews, up until recently what we have been hearing from Arsenal is "Other teams are too defensive.", "Ref linesman ref" or "Pitch was not right." or "Other team were thugs"

I think there's two things here. One, the Arsenal players admit he says very different things to them behind closed doors than he does in public. We don't know for sure what's going on there, but I agree to a certain extent that he would get more loyalty from the fans and more of a reaction if he admitted when things obviously were going wrong.

Two, like hell does Ferguson come out usually in public to slate his players. I mean, come on - he's just picked up a 5-game ban for blaming officals for his teams abject performances, and he often says something ludicrous to take the heat off his team and avoid criticising them directly.

Ben Foster had a stinker? He blames Alan Whiley for not being fit enough.

Wenger is far from alone in saying one thing in public and one thing behind closed doors. While I agree with you that he needs to stop it and admit the failings (if he wants respect from the fans and more backing in the stadium), by the same token it's silly to think that "100%" of the team's problems come because his players read the papers but don't talk to him on the training ground.

We just don't know how what he admits to himself compares to what he admits in public. This summer may give some clues.

[Dr Naysay]

Ferguson does call out refs but he has no issue calling his players out either, less than a month ago after losing to Manchester city in the FA cup he called out Scholes for the sending off as well as Van der Sar and Carrick for the goal, and Berbatov for his miss.

[Xulu]

Here is to hoping Stoke beat Man City so Arsenal can maybe salvage third.

Some changes are certainly in order.

[keefa]

Villa!

[Xulu]

Maybe the Europa League will be good for Arsenal next year.

[juvehero]

Xulu, on 17 May 2011 - 11:12 PM, said:

Maybe the Europa League will be good for Arsenal next year.

Maybe

[Xulu]

juvehero, on 19 May 2011 - 07:39 PM, said:

Maybe

Trying to be optimistic here. Don't ruin it.

[Dr Naysay]

Interested to hear some thoughts on the current Arsenal situation. There are reports of Clichy, Nasri and Bendtner wanting out, losing Clichy might not be that bad although Gael Clichy is currently the only player on the Arsenal squad to have a winners medal with Arsenal. Liverpool are reported to have made an offer for him. I have some questions for my fellow FM Britain brethren.

1) Is Arsene Wenger entering the last chance saloon? IMO if he does not win anything next season he is gone, whether he leaves himself or is fired. I am not even sure the Carling Cup would suffice, another aspect to take in is what if he gets drawn in the pre-lims of the CL to say Bayern and they get knocked out?

2) Is the fact that Arsenal have consistently lost some of their most effective players, and that they willingly wanted to leave(Adebayor, Flamini, Toure, Henry, Cole) a reflection on Wenger, or his footballing policy?

3) Has Arsene become another Louis van Gaal who places too much trust in younger players to the detriment of the team?

Losing Bendnter will hurt the most after all he is going to be the(Self proclaimed) best striker in the world.

[Millie]

1) Yes, I think he does need to win something meaningful this season. It was said that if he didn't win stuff players would want to walk, and that is proving to be the case. Clichy and Bendtner are not the biggest losses, but if he were to lose Fabregas AND Nasri he would have to do some very, very shrewd business for it to work out.

Arsenal can't draw Bayern Munich in the CL qualifiers, since both will be seeded. But the point is a good one. If they screw up and don't qualify the club is in real trouble.

2) You say they lose these players, but of the list you've given who was integral to the team, and who actually made the team significantly weaker?

Adebayor was a dressing room problem - good player, but good riddance.
Flamini only started to play really well in his final year, went to AC Milan and hasn't exactly looked like the Next Big Thing.
Toure had reached the end of the line with Arsenal and needed a new challenge. He didn't get on with certain people in the dressing room (Gallas, in this case), and it should have been a good excuse to bring through new centre back talent. He was directly replaced with Vermaelen (who is better, in my opinion, as a long and short term option).
Cole was also a disruptive mercenary who took time to really get going at Chelsea due to injury. The money Arsenal received plus William Gallas in that deal was an excellent piece of business by Wenger for which I'm not sure he gets enough credit.

And then there's Henry. The team had one of their better seasons once he left, challenging for the title. With him gone, the dressing room not only took responsibility for their own performances but they were given the freedom to express themselves. For the good of the club and the team, the time was right for Henry to go. £16m in cash and the opportunity to build for the future was, again, good business.

I would say that the club is back in this Henry complex with Cesc Fabregas. If they can get Barcelona to stump up £40m+ and that money is reinvested in the two or three players the squad needs then again this could be good for the team.

The problem in recent years is that the re-investment has gone into 16-year-olds not 26-year-olds. Constantly building for the future and not paying enough head to the present has meant that morale is low and players want to leave. Wenger has usually sold players at the right time - the issue in recent years is that he hasn't BOUGHT at the right time.

So, to be honest, who cares that those players wanted to leave? It hasn't harmed the club in the long or the short term. The problem has more come from Arsenal standing still rather than improving along with their rivals.

3) I would err towards "no", but only just. I think that putting faith in use is not a problem. Putting faith in ONLY youth and planning for 5, 6 years into the future when the team haven't won anything of note in years IS a problem. For that reason alone, I think he needs to modify his plan to at least have the team fighting in the final week of the season for the title.

[Xulu]

Bendtner and Clichy can go in my opinion (along with several others). Nasri, however, needs to be kept. My guess is that Chamakh will find some form again and that Gibbs will be given LB unless he cannot stay off of the physio's table. Nasri is vital for the club though as he can play along the AM trio and has very high class.

I think Wenger is not done if Arsenal are winless this year, but next year he may well be.

[JobsinS.A]

Xulu, on 18 June 2011 - 08:15 PM, said:

Bendtner and Clichy can go in my opinion (along with several others). Nasri, however, needs to be kept. My guess is that Chamakh will find some form again and that Gibbs will be given LB unless he cannot stay off of the physio's table. Nasri is vital for the club though as he can play along the AM trio and has very high class.

I think Wenger is not done if Arsenal are winless this year, but next year he may well be.

I agree with you Gibbs will find his form again.Hopefully...

This post has been edited by big_evil: 24 November 2011 - 11:25 AM